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Staff not required all the time - do they still have to be paid?Business Community Home > Finance and Tax Forum > Payroll and PAYE Forum |
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| Original Message Added : 5 Jul 2011 Paying on an hourly rate could end up being very expensive. Initially when the business starts up I may not need staff in the building all the time. How do I get round not paying staff when I don't require them to work? |
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| Reply : 5 Jul 2011 - (Edited : 5 Jul 2011) I am afraid you do have to pay employees mimimum wage, that is why it is called what it is. Are you satisfied that you have done your homework fully, namely prepared cashflows and projections to make sure that the figures stack up? There is not much point in starting a new venture if overheads such as wages are going to eat up all the profits. For the children's nurseries that I have dealt with there are usually a wide range of differently experienced/qualified employees, trainees etc., so a number on lower rate minimum wages, based on age. They are all profitable, even where the business owner plays little more than an overall managerial role. If the individuals were self employed you could pay them a price for a job of work so as non-employees, minimum wage rate is not relevant, it is up to the individual to ensure they are charging enough to make a living. That said, in your line of business this is unlikely to be an option due to insurance requirements, local authority limitations etc. If you have not yet sought professional input I would suggest that now is the time to do so, before you start throwing cash away. This should also bring help with how to price services, market your business etc. Good luck.
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| Reply : 5 Jul 2011 Yes you do indeed have to make sure that all your staff receive the minimum wage, if you have salaried staff without set hours it is your responsibility to make sure that they don't work so many hours that the salary you pay them works out at less than the applicable minimum wage rate per hour worked. You certainly, don't need to pay staff if you don't require them to work though and you do this with a contract that provides for flexible hours. There is no problem doing this legally, however, you may find it difficult to keep hold of your staff if you can't guarantee them a certain amount of hours. You can, however, guarantee them part time hours and offer them more if needed. It may suit your business to have staff on different types of contract to cover your changing requirements and it would be very prudent to take advice on this issue before you start. Employment law is an area where problems can be easily prevented but once you allow a problem to arise it can be extremely expensive to resolve. Prevention is definitely better than cure in this instance and things will run much more smoothly with a solid foundation from the outset. Good luck! Jenny
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| Reply : 5 Jul 2011 As a parent, that is exactly the type of childcare service I have sought. It is a rarity. Also as a parent, I am not prepared to leave my children with just anyone so that I can work. So, if you are worrying about staff costs which could lead you to make some dodgy decisions about who you hire, then one can only assume that you are not up and running yet? If that is the case, start advertising your service and promote yourself. Have a start date to advertise so that parents know when this service will begin. In other words, fill your booking sheet in advance of opening. Parents need this type of childcare. So commit to a start date and market like mad.
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| Reply : 11 Jul 2011 The basic question that you ask about minimum wage has already been answered. I recall that something known as a working time directive came into existence some years ago as part of harmonisation with Europe. You mention long hours and this was what the directive was all about. This type of rule illustrates that it really is no fun being an employer! Many small business ventures face exactly the same dilemma as you and very often the answer lies in finding a like minded individual prepared to work hard and cover long hours just as you are prepared to do to make a success of the venture, providing cover and support for each other along the way and lessening the potential burdens of being an employer. This type of arrangement, a partnership, may have significant benefits for the success of the venture although you need to be sure that any partner you choose to work with adds value to the basic concept. Partners need not necessarily be close friends and often it helps to maintain a business perspective and provides challenge and change if they are not. Keep in mind that the type of salary/wage cost that you are referring to is a direct cost closely related to the numbers attending and needs to be managed as such. Other types of organisations have similar staffing issues and use solutions that enable the business to draw on a pool of resources i.e. people willing to work part time and flexibly at short notice. Good luck with your venture.
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| Reply : 21 Jul 2011 Here is my view on this, advertise that you need a child care assistant who are cbi checked with a minimal NVQ IN Child care to work as a self employed person.. for a profit share say 30 % or whatever! of your fee per hour per child that way the more they work the more they earn....or not as the case maybe if things work out in a few months you may then be able to employ full time staff, Find yourself a good accountant! lots on here Best of luck with your new venture Lightweight Movers |
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| Reply : 26 Aug 2011 Just a quick word on paying self-employed people. be very very careful about this, employing self-employed personal should not be said in the same sentence. there are strict rules stating whether someone is employed or self-employed, and as an Employer you will need to satisfy yourself that they are truly self-employed. See HMRC guidance on Employment status: employed or self-employed Regards Jodie Rotherham Payroll Services tel: 01709 291595 www.rotherhampayroll.com |
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| Reply : 27 Aug 2011 The most important thing you get them signed the contract. HMRC has their own self employed test(like whether they need have to bring their equipment, tools, the flexibility of working hours, if they can get someone to replcae them etc) Thanks Harry Lee SC Lee Accountant Ltd |
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| Reply : 25 Oct 2011 Here is a link: http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/TheNationalMinimumWage/DG_10027201 If you prefer not to click links, visit the website and search for National Minimum Wage. The rates change annually on 1st Oct so diarise that date and keep up to speed on this. Under the Working Time Regulations, workers should only work a max of 48hrs per week over an average period of 17 weeks. Workers may "opt out" of the Working Time Regs - if they sign a simple Opt Out Agreement. But they must be free to opt back in if they choose - otherwise you are infringing their rights. However, your Opt Out Agreement can include provision about how much notice they have to give to opt back in. The maximum notice you can insist on for opting back in is 3 months. It is important to keep a record of every employee's working hours. Although you are not obliged to keep a record of hours for opted-out employees, I recommend that you keep a record anyway. Keeping detailed records helps you when it comes to calculating holiday entitlement. I'm not sure whether anyone else has mentioned it but you could always employ staff using a "zero hours" contract. With that type of contract you are not obliged to provide work and you only pay for the hours worked. This may suit some employees who are happy to be flexible or who'd rather not make a regular commitment, but not those who require a regular income on which they rely. You could perhaps use both forms of employment contract within your organisation. I think it's unlikely that your workers will meet the HMRC self-employed criteria - which could leave your company liable if they fail to pay their taxes, etc. So do visit the HMRC website (as previously suggested) and use the self-employed assessment tool. Print out the result and keep it on file. It's best to play by the rules from the outset. And a final word... if you are using temp staff, there are new regulations which came into force on 1st October 2011 called the Agency Workers Regulations. Even Temp Staff can attract the same benefits as employed staff. You'll find more details on the Business Link website - www.businesslink.gov.uk Good luck! I hope it all goes smoothly for you and that your business is successful. Barbara The Back Office www.TheBackOffice.co.uk Providing support for small businesses, including legally compliant employment documentation |
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| Reply : 3 Sep 2012 Did you manage to get this sorted out? Jon |
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